Taxi speed penalty during take-off run

[Quantum]

Hi DK,

New beta 0.2 seems to detect the normal take-off run as a taxi-speed penalty. When you change code for that, check code for landing so the fault doesn't get shifted to that .

Regards

John

[DaveB]

Cheers John.. just had one and added it to the end of the Aircraft Check thread! As reported there, it is impossible for an overspeed to have occured

ATB

DaveB

[DaKurt]

Ok...you are only allowed to taxi over 25 knots for 50 seconds. I don't know if that is to short?

But furthermore there really was a bug. If you rolled > 25 knots for 50 seconds and took off and landed afterwards the penalty was set after 10 seconds. This is fixed now.

[DaveB]

Cheers Claudio

It takes probably 10secs to get airbourne in a Rapide and a similar time to come to a stop on full brakes Will download v03 asap and see how that goes

ATB

DaveB

[Stan]

I got dinged for overspeed on my T/O run and also dinged for overspeed at 11400 ft.The addition is still way out but in favour of pilot now.The flight disappeared off the flight monitor on going to 8x and showed as a booked flight but client still logging flight.
ps.You brought out version beta03 during the course of my flight.

[DaKurt]

BETA 0.2 had a problem with the taxi-penalty. Please check this again.

I made an error when writing the 250 overspeed check and wrote a - instead of a +. That's why it gets those height limits a bit wrong. Same for Landing Lights On Over 10.000. Those two don't work properly, but are already fixed! You will not have any of those problems in BETA 0.4 (Btw. when checking for "> 250" and "Landing Lights on over 10.000" it is always refering to FL 100, not 10.000 feet)

[simondix]

On a similar vein, I have just completed a flight from EGLL to EGPD. As I touched down at EGPD I incurred a taxispeed penalty. I deliberately taxied at EGLL at 27 kts and did not get dinged.


Simon

[MMattyK]

I also got hit with this just as I rotated off runway 02 at EBBR on my way to Sockholm ESSA, not only that, with the parking brakes applied I also got hit with still rolling when flight ended. I did note however that there were several instances of the new FSclient running when I checked processes at the point where I used the client end flight, and got a client not responding from microsoft, yet the comment and flight obviously completed as it shows in the airline history.
On a sperate note there were some really strange actions on just opening flynet as a stand alone looking at the reports... it said I had landed at the wrong airport!

[DaveB]

Hi Mat

I believe there is a 50sec time period allocated for you to get into the air once rolling and if you're longer than this you get zapped for an overspeed I tried it as an experiment flying a T2 and sure as eggs were eggs.. up came the penalty just as my gear had lifted off. This seems a bit of a pointless penalty to me I'm afraid. I'm dreading taking a heavy 747-136 on a transatlantic!!

The rolling penalty is fixed but not implemented yet so if you're running real weather.. make sure you stop with your tail into the wind before applying the brake

ATB

DaveB

[tjbaughn]

well there goes my rating "Dinged as well for Taxi Speed"

[MMattyK]

Does this mean you can no-longer do a rolling start when given clearance by ATC...?

[DaveB]

Hi Mat..

I honestly don't know is the answer but I'll try it on my next flight in a Viking which should be interesting!. If you start from the runway and open the gas for your takeoff run.. you get the warning prompt 'Flight State - Taxiing' which is a little disconcerting. I presume this is the same as the 'ding' we used to get on the FlyNET client to show the flight had started when 5 or 6kts had been passed but it's not as useful!. If you run very heavy and/or an old dog or you don't use a full power takeoff setting.. things get mighty worrying toward the other end of the runway. It'd be better if the text prompt for taxiing either wasn't there or changed to something like takeoff roll when you opened the gas.. at which point you'd be aware you had 50secs to get into the air.

All in all.. I don't think many of us here are happy with this addition, especially in it's present form. Exceeding 25kts while taxiing.. fine but to be penalised for an extended takeoff run is hardly as real as it gets is it Maybe an explanation of when the transition from taxi to takeoff roll occurs would be helpful Perhaps this is at the magic 26kts point??

EDIT..
A logical thought in a world of madness You must be able to taxi for as long as you so wish while keeping below 25kts as there are no runs from the gate to the runway that are sub 1 minute. I figure that should you taxi and exceed 25kts, where you would have got stung for a taxi speed violation before, this now manifests itself after you've taken off hence.. from 25tks, you have 50secs to get airbourne. If your run exceeds this, you get the taxi overspeed. If you get off before, it's taken as part of the takeoff run.. if that makes sense

EDIT#2..
Well.. I hung onto the takeoff for longer than 50secs after 25kts from a standing start on the runway and didn't get ding-donged. Perhaps 50secs is wrong!

ATB

DaveB

[CAPFlyer]

I just flew a flight with the Fokker 28 using 1.0.2 and can confirm there is still something wrong with the calculations or the detection. What I saw was the following -

I lined up on the runway and stopped (ATC hold). I advanced the throttles and released the brakes once initial power had stabilized. I then went to full takeoff power (normal takeoff procedure) and rotated about 2/3 down the runway at the proper speeds. Less than 5 seconds after the wheels left the ground I got dinged for a taxi penalty and THEN the FSAirlines "State" changed to Takeoff. Should the State not change to Takeoff prior to becoming airborne?

Claudio, I think there needs to be a rework where the speed penalty is disabled above a certain speed and this also be the detection for takeoff (say 50 knots). If the wheels do not leave the ground and the plane slows back below 25 knots, then the penalty would be re-enabled and a rejected takeoff would then be noted (no penalty) to reset the penalty and status systems.

[hezza]

Claudio, I think there needs to be a rework where the speed penalty is disabled above a certain speed and this also be the detection for takeoff (say 50 knots). If the wheels do not leave the ground and the plane slows back below 25 knots, then the penalty would be re-enabled and a rejected takeoff would then be noted (no penalty) to reset the penalty and status systems.

I think there would at least be a chance then that some pilots would taxi at 60 knots, and then avoid a penalty by slowing to below 25 knots before the take off run.

[MMattyK]

I did notice that on starting the client that even though nothing was going on, the speed was showing at 3kts, which turned out to be the TAS being detected at the gate, and not the GS, which is where I think some of the problems occur.
Regarding the 50 seconds, I often use TO-2 to save engine wear on my 737 series a/c which makes attaining lift-off takes that bit longer.