Take off weight problem

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AdySmith
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Take off weight problem

Post by AdySmith » Thu Nov 28, 2019 9:14 am

I am flying the VC8 (Rick Piper model).

The FSA client tells me that I am overweight for take off despite the figures displayed for MTOW being well in excess of actual TOW.

Any idea why?
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Cat
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Re: Take off weight problem

Post by Cat » Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:36 pm

any chance of posting a screenshot of client in loading window after fueling?
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AdySmith
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Re: Take off weight problem

Post by AdySmith » Fri Nov 29, 2019 8:58 am

FSA-MTOW.jpg
FSA-MTOW.jpg (54.54 KiB) Viewed 1764 times
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AdySmith
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Re: Take off weight problem

Post by AdySmith » Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:14 am

Anybody got any ideas on this one?
It doesn't seem to matter how much fuel I load, it is still over weight by 430 Kg, current flight ZFW 24924, fuel 1600, TOW 26524, MTOW 32886, OVER BY 430 KG!

It is seriously limiting how many passengers I can carry hence profit margin.

(The system won't let me load packages on this aircraft either, says there is a cargo limit of zero)
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joefremont
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Re: Take off weight problem

Post by joefremont » Sat Dec 14, 2019 4:32 pm

Yeah, those numbers don't add up. I have on my todo list to fix that for 3.4, sometimes if you go back to the fuel page and return to the confirm/payload page it fixes itself, but its defiantly something I need to look into.
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Cat
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Re: Take off weight problem

Post by Cat » Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:18 pm

Yeah, the Client needs to be prodded sometimes ......
This morning my ZFW's not matching .....

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so I open the load planner and see they are the same numbers ... Client math is wrong.

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close the load planner with OK
now the Client gets a "prod" and recalculates the numbers and is accurate.

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Last edited by Cat on Sat Dec 28, 2019 6:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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AdySmith
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Re: Take off weight problem

Post by AdySmith » Sat Dec 28, 2019 10:19 am

I have tried all of the above but I am still always 430 Kg overweight.

Even tried loading 430 Kg too much fuel, then going back and reducing it by 430 Kg but to no effect.

The only way to get the client to start the flight is by clicking the change button against the passenger number.

Any ideas, Joe??
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Cat
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Re: Take off weight problem

Post by Cat » Sat Dec 28, 2019 10:21 pm

I am assuming you are flying the Vickers 800 - If you look at the FSA database, the zero fuel weights do not match what the Client has vs. the database by the number you are overweight.

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Now exactly WHY the Client is not pulling the correct number from the database: umm Joe, you are up to bat! ;)
The lbs to kg conversion in the database IS correct. 54000 lbs = 24494 kg (rounded up)
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AdySmith
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Re: Take off weight problem

Post by AdySmith » Mon Dec 30, 2019 9:04 am

Yes, the Rick Piper Viscount 800.

As you say those figures have the exact 430 Kg discrepancy.
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joefremont
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Re: Take off weight problem

Post by joefremont » Thu Jan 02, 2020 7:18 am

Sorry for my silence on this for so long, its been a busy few months but with the holidays I finally have had a chance to catch up.

The client is currently showing the ZFW but is not showing the MZFW from the database, but it does have it.

Empty weight of 18600 kg+ 6324 kg of pax = 24924 kg ZFW, 430 kg more than the MZFW of 24494 kg.

So in this case either the number of passengers or the MZFW is incorrect. We are probably going to have to go through the database and adjust all the aircraft where 102kg * passengers is more than mzfw - dow, I just did a query on the database and see more than 140 aircraft where that is true. Many aircraft only allow 77kg for each passenger carried, enough for the passenger, but not there baggage. The booking functions checked MZFW when figuring out how much cargo you could carry but if passengers weight exceeded it it did not stop it.

the older clients only checked that you did not exceed MTOW, but recent updates check you don't exceed MZFW or MLW (taking into account ZFW + reserve fuel) which is why this has not come up in the past.

I will probably also have to update the aircraft edit page to not allow this in the future.
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joefremont
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Re: Take off weight problem

Post by joefremont » Thu Jan 02, 2020 6:35 pm

Going through the some of the aircraft where the passenger weight exceeds MZFW it occurs to me that many only exceed zero fuel weight if all the seats are economy seats, substitute some of them business or first class seats and your not over the limit any more. Do we allow aircraft to have be specified to allow enough economy seats so that they can create historical mixed class configurations or do we make it a hard and fast rule that the number of passengers does not exceed the MZFW.

IF we allow the passenger limit to exceed MZFW then if someone does configure for all economy the booking system would have to limit the number of passengers to not exceed MZFW.
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I've sworn an oath of solitude until the pestilence is purged from the lands.

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