leasing suggestion

Shodan · Post by **Shodan** » Sat Nov 17, 2007 6:24 pm

Again, speaking as a leasee ... I have only ever changed the registration cos I can ..... the easiest solution would be to simply remove the option to change the reg when someone leases a plane ... that would be fine by all the leasees, I am sure.

Stan · Post by **Stan** » Sat Nov 17, 2007 7:50 pm

[So the one day lease, which looked promising at $1m for the day, actually was $7.5m with a $22m deposit ... not such a good deal.... I ended up flying one of my other a/c while the jumbo was being serviced. ]
RE the above,if you service the aircraft on return it will only cost you $7.5M as the deposit was only taken if you didn,t service the aircraft.I personally have had two aircraft returned which needed repairs costing $96.5m and $46m,both from the same person.It was because of this the large deposits were put in place.But deposits do not matter now as the cost of repairs is taken automatically on the aircrafts return.

Shodan · Post by **Shodan** » Sun Nov 18, 2007 1:08 am

Hi Stan,

Please see my previous posts, I have no problem with you guys protecting your investment ... my point is .. why should I pay for what other idiots are doing to your planes?

... Having to do an A-check on a jumbo after 2-3 flights is not reasonable either.

Target the arseholes who are messing with you, not screw with the rest of us .. You make money out of leasing or you wouldn't be doing it .....

... to repeat .... just playing Devils Advocate here

Regards
Shodan

CAPFlyer · Post by **CAPFlyer** » Sun Nov 18, 2007 1:23 am

I would tend to agree as well guys. If you're doing a lease, expecting 95% on return is acceptable on a short term lease, expecting 100% on return is not. Even at that, I would suggest considering allowing some leeway on return instead of requiring 100% on even long term leases as it is not realistic to expect the airline to transfer the plane to YOUR base and then do repairs on it. In the real world, the airline operating the aircraft is responsible only for the repairs and preventative maintenance required while they are operating the aircraft. Any maintenance required beyond the end of the lease falls back upon the lessor. HOWEVER, most lessors have a clause that any "excessive" damage to the aircraft found upon return will be repaired at the lessee's expense, hence the need for the deposit, but with the new setup, the repairs are automatically billed to the lessee if the aircraft is in a worse condition than required by the lease agreement, removing most of the need for the deposit.

Shodan · Post by **Shodan** » Sun Nov 18, 2007 5:23 pm

I have a question regarding this short term lease thing ...

If I took a one day lease, which required a 100% a/c on return, I fly it once and it goes to 99.9% .. there is less time left on the lease than the 24hrs it takes to have an A-check done ..

.. so what happens in that situation? At best, the a/c will still be being serviced when it returns to the owner.

Will the software deduct the deposit since it is not out of service when the term is up.

Regards

Shodan

Post by **joefremont** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 6:15 am

Shodan, your reading of this is correct, at the end of the lease the aircraft goes in for its A-Check, since it in for its check it will be unavailable for the standard amount of time, the leasee is charged for the maintenance and the deposit is returned.

Ionathan · Post by **Ionathan** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:32 am

Shodan wrote:I have a question regarding this short term lease thing ...

If I took a one day lease, which required a 100% a/c on return, I fly it once and it goes to 99.9% .. there is less time left on the lease than the 24hrs it takes to have an A-check done ..

.. so what happens in that situation? At best, the a/c will still be being serviced when it returns to the owner.

Will the software deduct the deposit since it is not out of service when the term is up.

Regards

Shodan

Shodan, I will agree with you as it concerns the short term leasings. The truth is that most VAs offer leasings for more than 30 days. However the new leasing system offers a lot more flexibility. In Ionathan Airlines, we offer leasings generaly for 90 and 120 days, without a deposit but with the requirement to have the aircraft back at 100% state. As I said this concerns the long term leasing. We can also make a special agreement for a short term period (just a few days) in which case a 96% of state would be acceptable. This is what I mean "the new system is more flexible". I think everyone (well most) understands both sides. It's a matter of agreement and which airline you contact for an agreement. There are for sure some who try their "worst" to make money out of a leasee but those are exception, I want to believe. On the other hand I find it perfectly reasonable that someone does not want to receive an aircraft back in 45% status, having to pay more than he/she received, whilst the leasee (after 30 or 60 days) has made a few hundred millions. Is it unfair?